I love my KTM200 to bits and the ride is unbelievable fun. However I suffer from more pains in my right arm/shoulder since having the 2T - compared with my WRs before.
I have had a bad right shoulder for many years - think it was from an old taikwondo pad training injury (Was holding a kick pad when the instructor gave it a massive jumping turning kick - as the pad flung back it wrenched my shoulder with it). my shoulder flexibility has always been poor (even before this). I use the gym regularly but can't flat bench with a barbell as when I start increasing the weights, my shoulder starts to give pain that lasts weeks -- dont get this issue so much using dumbbells. I try focussing on extra exercises - like rowing, wrist curls as well as all the other standard exercises.
When I'm riding I suffer from right arm pain (can be shoulder or elbow or forearm or wrist -- so I think the weakness is the shoulder and the other muscles and joints have to compensate). On several occasitem I've had finger cramps too in the same Hand. if the going is too bumpy or the lane too long I often have to have a few seconds sit every now and then -- if I try to just grin and bear it things hurt too much and I find myself perilously close to crashing (especially on the little 2t where you need to be uber gentle on the throttle).
This weekend has peed me off more - as played an easy game of squash with Troy n Saturday (I haven't played in years) and I've been in shoulder/elbow pain since.
I haven't seen a doctor about this - but if an operation is involved then I'm not sure I'm ready for such drastic action.
I'm sure the pains have been worse since I've gone 2t. Obviously riding style and throttle control is different - and maybe my shoulder can't cope with this. I have tried a few alterations of bar position and now got risers too. But still pain is bad on certain lanes - and once there tends to dampen a lot of my riding thereafter.
Does it make sense that a 2T would make this worse ?
Do I need to go back to a light 4T ? (I'd hate to change and find no difference).
Worth having a chat with a doctor, I had drop arm syndrome and the doctor was crap, but she told me of a physio that could help, private of course. 4 sessions with him and my shoulder has been great for over a year now, just think it is worth perusing other avenues first.
As to the 2T vs 4T, all I will say is 4T is much easier to ride than a 2T.
Sat here now with a brace on my right elbow after todays riding on my 2t I have found that sticking another 20 odd MM of rise to my bars has helped. Personally I think for me its the fact I have to 'work' when riding the 2T and there are more than a few times when I'm 'hanging on' and get arm pump - once I relax then it eases a great deal, it does I note coincide wish how 'pressured' I feel on a ride and its not a problem I have ever noticed when riding alone (and am totally relaxed).
There is also no doubt that the 2 T is more vibey so perhaps that is also a factor?
It sounds like you have not yet got the bike set up for your optimum riding position.
Keep on trying different combinations of risers and handlebar positions until you find the sweet spot which allows you to hold, (but not grip), the bars in a loop made between thumb and forefinger when stood up in a relaxed position on the the pegs. This will mean that all effort can be focussed on operating the controls, rather than just hanging on.
I had awful pains in my forearms when I first got the CCM and it took several rides, and a few adjustments to the bars, and trying differring heights using all the spacers that came with the risers before I was comfortable.
Keep at it. You should be able to set it up so everything is to hand without stretching, and it should be balanced enough that you only need to be on board, neither leaning on nor holding onto the bars for balance, which aggravates any pre-existing strain.
Best bet is go see a doctor. My shoulder was so bad i thought the joint was knackered. Turns out it was just a tendon problem. Three visits to a physio (nhs) and 2 months later after about 30 minutes a day using a strip of rubber to gently stretch the muscles and it was back to normal. Wish i hadn't waited 9 months before seeing the doctor as i thought a major operation was on the cards.
Moaning again are we Chiropractor yes it cost but I can't be bothered to spend half my life waiting for the NHS. Just to see a physio was 8 weeks whilst not working. So went to my chiropractor,4 visits over 2 weeks and I was back to work and feeling great. I go every 10 weeks now just to keep it all good. When I get on the bike after a session I'm feel really naughty looking for things to ride.
As for the doc - you are right I should go I have private cover from work but need a doc referral first. Only issue is since I left plymouth 18 months ago I haven't joined a docs. Oops.
Go to your old doctor your still with them untill you get a new one.
I am sure not long after I moved they gave me a time limit on this. Not sure of actual rules though. But in all honesty it would make sense for me to register locally - after all ya dont know when you're going to need 'em.
I was referred to Mr Kitson at the Nuffield/RD and E, he got my shoulder fixed with a combo of physio (also with a rubber band) for a rotator tendon problem and tennis elbow and hydro-dilation for the frozen shoulder that followed.
Not 100% now but much much better. Pete's advice is sound unless you are 6'4" - they just don't make risers big enough!
I think Mark already knows what the problem is. Riding a bike that demands more user input has agrovated a previous injury. Also vibrations can trigger muscles to activate more - like all those new vibrating exercise machines. This is the 2nd 200cc 2T he's had and it's not as if he's only just bought it and is having trouble settling in, is it 2 years now you've been on a 2T or longer?
The only other factors are, have you hurt your shoulder with any other activities since moving from the WR (excluding the squash game)? If not then I think you shoudl concider medical help and also get another bike for a while, maybe alternate use.
for what its worth I had a similar experience when moving up from a little xr 250 to the beta 450rr.
The key was in the setup.
First job was to tame the throttle- I cut a slightly deeper grove in the throttle cable guide on the twist grip. It draws slightly less cable in the early stages and takes much of the sting out of uncontrolled aceleration- detail on the TVTR web site-
next was to get the bars the right height and angle- risers made a huge difference- especially when standing.
Finally get the suspension set up well. You need enough slow speed comp on the front to maintain sensible pitch control but soft enough to smooth out the smaller bumps. Also found that the rebound settings on the forks make a massive difference to ride plushness and handling. Too much causes packing and harshness. Too little causes uncontrolled rebound and harshness.
You feel much more confident when the bike handles well and you relax as a result. Once relaxed the tension subsides and you use much less energy.
Well - in true man style I've not yet been to the doc. In all honesty its not easy now when you live 32 miles frfom where you work and when you work office hours (in other words by the time I get home the surgery's close to closing !!). But I guess that's an excuse which I really could work around I needs-be.
Pain this week has been ongoing - seems to be a combination of lower wrist, elbow and shoulder - but not always together ???? In addition I went tentively went to the gym on Monday and rowed 4000m without any pain. After session this new ache (since squash) returned). On Tuesday I ran a charity circuit training session and made us all complete 200 press-ups (not all in one go, but over a 30 minute period between other exercises). Again the press ups did not aggrevate this at all. Felt ok after and the ache returned shortly after. On a more positive note, seems slightly less from later last night.
I do think this game of squash has un-earthed the underlying issue. But what that issue is.................I guess thats one for the doc or physio to work out.
The main areas where are sturggle on the 2T are very bumpy conditions (and there's more of these on the lanes now the surface mud has been washed away) and very much moreso uphill -- combine the 2 and I'm up and down on the seat like a yo yo.
The main areas where are sturggle on the 2T are very bumpy conditions (and there's more of these on the lanes now the surface mud has been washed away) and very much moreso uphill -- combine the 2 and I'm up and down on the seat like a yo yo.
This sounds like a by-product of the gyroscopic 4 stroke effect (now missing).
"(4) Stutter bumps. There is something about the gyroscopic effect, crankshaft weight, centralized mass, every other firing cycle and well-aimed front wheel that makes stutter bumps disappear on a four-stroke (until they get too bigthen watch the front wheel)."
Oh dear. I took Darren's EXC-F 250 out yesterday for a few hours. Did a lot of the lanes that I know I normally struggle with. Guess what?? ........ No pain and continually stood up for every lane.
Is it simply a 2T v 4T thing for my symptoms? Most probably. However two things I noticed that I need to try before saying goodby to my little 200. #1 is his bars were quite forward. I've tried a multitude of positions but I'll replicate his angle and retry on mine. Secondly is his suspension was soaking up the bumps far better than mine. Now I know some of this will be down to the 4T smoothness and gyroscopic effects, but also my suspension is set as stock. Which is fine for my weight but probably not best for laning. So I will look to back off the suspension a little too. Then I'll give it a final go. If still bad then an EXC-F is very likely.
Now I'm no suspension guru, but if I want to mellow things out, where do I start (primarily the front end but will do rear as well) - only thing I've ever done so far is rear shock sag (preload).
Neither am I buddy, but I just wind out the adjustment 5 or 6 clicks for a long days laning. A lighter fork oil may work well for you, but I would do that as a last resort before selling.
I have found that sticking another 20 odd MM of rise to my bars has helped. Personally I think for me its the fact I have to 'work' when riding the 2T and there are more than a few times when I'm 'hanging on' and get arm pump - once I relax then it eases a great deal, it does I note coincide wish how 'pressured' I feel on a ride and its not a problem I have ever noticed when riding alone (and am totally relaxed).
. So went to my chiropractor,4 visits over 2 weeks and I was back to work and feeling great.
